[pct-l] Pct-l Digest, Vol 28, Issue 53
northshore_sandman at hotmail.com
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Sat Apr 10 05:16:04 CDT 2010
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-----Original Message-----
From: pct-l-request at backcountry.net
Date: Fri, 09 Apr 2010 22:40:19
To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Subject: Pct-l Digest, Vol 28, Issue 53
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Today's Topics:
1. Swarthout Canyon (nosirreeb)
2. Re: Class of 2010 - Fuel Canisters, Agua Dulce (anna mathys)
3. fuel canister by USPS? (anna mathys)
4. faucet at Paradise Cafe (Mary Kwart)
5. Re: fuel canister by USPS? (Timothy Nye)
6. Re: faucet at Paradise Cafe (Timothy Nye)
7. fuel canister by USPS? (Frank Dumville)
8. Billy Goat's lost poles (Joseph Anderson)
9. Billy Goat's lost poles (ruffwork)
10. Free PCT Data Book (Justin Smith)
11. Re: Class of 2010 - Fuel Canisters, Agua Dulce (Edward Anderson)
12. fuel canister by USPS? (Lance Marshall)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 18:26:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: nosirreeb <nosirreeb at yahoo.com>
Subject: [pct-l] Swarthout Canyon
To: pct-l at mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <35045.48551.qm at web31813.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> It seems to have become the bureaucratic "easy out" to close off
> entire areas because it is "too dangerous" for the public
Hmmm ... I always supposed the after-fire closures were to protect the terrain from unnecessary erosion, allow vegetation to regrow, and to enable wildlife to repopulate the area, not to protect people. These processes can take years and I support the effort.
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 19:16:01 -0700
From: anna mathys <haexli333 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Class of 2010 - Fuel Canisters, Agua Dulce
To: dsaufley at sprynet.com
Cc: pct-l at mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID:
<g2l93b008bb1004091916n93e371e6kb18a42c20a6e1388 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Hi L-rod.
I use MSR fuel canisters, the smallest version. But I still couldn't figure
out if it's possible to send them with USPS. If it's possible easily, I'll
just ship them. If not, I might be interested in buying one in Agua Dulce,
maybe even a biger one that I'm used to.
AnnA
>
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------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 19:22:43 -0700
From: anna mathys <haexli333 at gmail.com>
Subject: [pct-l] fuel canister by USPS?
To: pct-l at backcountry.net
Message-ID:
<t2h93b008bb1004091922nc818d7bex1fb782092775cbd3 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
hi gang.
Anyone has updated information about sending butane cartiges/fuel
canister/compressed gas for cooking (sorry, don't know the correct
expression) with USPS or UPS? Conditions, prices? I went to the post office
and they told me it's impossible since 9/11, but I have also a sheet from
2004 which sais it's possible to send cartriges, if you lable the parcel
correctly. help!
AnnA
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Fri, 09 Apr 2010 19:29:56 -0700
From: Mary Kwart <mkwart at gci.net>
Subject: [pct-l] faucet at Paradise Cafe
To: pct-l at backcountry.net
Message-ID: <fc7efff11e62.4bbf8034 at gci.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
When I was there last May, the faucet I used was by the front door to the right--the waitress even directed me to it. There was also a hose attached to it. Maybe its just used later in the season.
--Fireweed
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 19:38:35 -0700
From: Timothy Nye <timpnye at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] fuel canister by USPS?
To: anna mathys <haexli333 at gmail.com>
Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
Message-ID:
<v2xbbf635931004091938gb47aea53xc0630172ec2f3b4b at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
It is possible with the proper warning, but often counter service employees
of the USPS are unaware and or unwilling to verify that this is the case.
Last year I brought in the chart to my now local post office and they
afterwards posted the requirements. At my then post office they flatly
refused. At the main post office they called the next level up the chain
for guidance and were left on hold leading us to both give up after 40
minutes (which is when I went to the post office referred to above)
I don't know if this helps. They have to ship the canisters by ground
transportation hence the special labeling requirements.
On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 7:22 PM, anna mathys <haexli333 at gmail.com> wrote:
> hi gang.
> Anyone has updated information about sending butane cartiges/fuel
> canister/compressed gas for cooking (sorry, don't know the correct
> expression) with USPS or UPS? Conditions, prices? I went to the post office
> and they told me it's impossible since 9/11, but I have also a sheet from
> 2004 which sais it's possible to send cartriges, if you lable the parcel
> correctly. help!
> AnnA
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------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 19:44:16 -0700
From: Timothy Nye <timpnye at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] faucet at Paradise Cafe
To: Mary Kwart <mkwart at gci.net>
Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
Message-ID:
<z2jbbf635931004091944n950dda5et63788fb48685102 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
That would tend to confirm my supposition that the crowd in the front was
the reason for being directed around back...or again, it could have been
either my presence or Big Toe for the direction to the service entrance
Big Toe, I meant no disrespect for your Leatherman. Especially in light of
the previous post forwarding the link to Trail Journals where the hiker had
to self arrest with one....not a conventional use, it is true. And I
thought being able to open a bottle of beer with a Bic lighter was being
utilitarian.
Gourmet
On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 7:29 PM, Mary Kwart <mkwart at gci.net> wrote:
> When I was there last May, the faucet I used was by the front door to the
> right--the waitress even directed me to it. There was also a hose attached
> to it. Maybe its just used later in the season.
>
> --Fireweed
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------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 20:09:15 -0700
From: "Frank Dumville" <fdumville at earthlink.net>
Subject: [pct-l] fuel canister by USPS?
To: "pct-l" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <C2B796C56CBB401D86B20EEB0612ACBA at AdminPC>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
AnnA
Here's a link to the Power's web page that has a good detailed description of how to ship fuel. Read it.
http://www.gottawalk.com/shipping_fuel.htm.
Basically you can only ship USPS surface mail only. NO priority mail.
Some suggestions which may or may not be covered in the link above.
You may have to be pretty assertive at the Post Office. It's always easier for them to say no. These regulations have nothing to do with 9/11 restrictions so the person you talked to didn't really know the regulations.
Read and print out the relevant pages of the USPS Pub 52 which governs the shipment of hazardous materials. See the gottawalk site for the link. Bring them to the Post Office so you can show them their own document that says it's ok to ship fuel. Know the regulations before you go. Don't ask if it's ok just tell them what you want to do. Ask to talk to the supervisor or the hazardous materials expert if there is any question. Be humble, patient and polite.
Try to go during non-peak business hours.
Make professional looking mailing labels on a printer with the proper marking. Print "Surface Mail Only" in red.
I sometimes bring a sample canister as an example to show them what is inside.
Ship your fuel separately from your other resupply items. Surface mail can take a long time to get to the small post offices along the trail and you don't want to lose everything if it doesn't get there.
I have had to go through several layers of employee's but have always been able to ship my fuel.
Snap
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 20:09:43 -0700
From: Joseph Anderson <joedaddy44 at gmail.com>
Subject: [pct-l] Billy Goat's lost poles
To: Pct-l at backcountry.net
Message-ID:
<h2z3618110d1004092009sd540f63bqe0ecd14745662b95 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
HELP: Billy Goat's hiking poles walked away without him! He was northbound
at the Red Rock water tank mile # 502.8 and he left his poles at the trail
intersection. After collecting water and returning to the trail they had
mysteriously vanished.
If anybody knows the poles' where abouts please contact the Anderson's or
bring them to the Kick Off party. No questions asked.
Any ideas for Billy Goat's pole replacement? Bob Mayon outfitted him with
bamboo sticks for now...
This situation brings to mind how should we, as a community of hikers, deal
with gear "found" unattached to their owners along the trail. Should it be
left, or brought to the trailhead, or considered trail salvage after a
certain period of time? What do you think?
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 20:27:15 -0700
From: ruffwork <ruffwork at ruffwork.com>
Subject: [pct-l] Billy Goat's lost poles
To: "pct-l at backcountry.net" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <EF9ED19F-C988-4DF4-B30B-299C65BB2E36 at ruffwork.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
I attach my email address to all my items so they
Can find their way home...
ruffwork
Sent from my iPhone!
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 20:30:08 -0700
From: Justin Smith <smilingjustin at gmail.com>
Subject: [pct-l] Free PCT Data Book
To: pct-l at backcountry.net
Message-ID:
<q2sa12b47871004092030v10ef339cka84236ee4ff5380e at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
I have an extra PCT data book that I would like to send to an excited
outdoor PCT enthusiast. Send me an inspiring hiking story and an address
and i'll send it to the top choice, and if you feel so compelled donate to
send a child to outdoor school at www.inspireout.com.
Thank you,
Justin
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 20:33:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Class of 2010 - Fuel Canisters, Agua Dulce
To: dsaufley at sprynet.com
Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
Message-ID: <989024.21192.qm at web111609.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Donna,
On my PCT ride from Mexico to Canada I mostly used the Snow Peak "Giga Power" canasters. I had started out using the Jetboil brand and then switched from Agua Dulce north. From A. Dulce I had gone to REI to buy more and was advised by the salesperson that the Snow Peak canisters were the same - just lower in cost. It does not really matter which brand Trish would stock - more important is which can be bought at the best price.
Before deciding on a stove for my journey I did a lot of research. For safety reasons I did not want to carry liquid fuels - and alcohol flames are virtually invisable. My research indicated that the Jetboil stove rated very high in fuel efficency (REI tests on how long it takes, and how much fuel it takes, for different stoves to bring an equal amount of water to a boil). For my five and one-half months on the trail I was very happy with my Jetboil because of it's reliability and easy lighting feature - you just turn on the gas and push a button. I found it to be trouble free.
My entire cook kit measures 7" in diameter and is slightly over 4" high. It weighs 1.2 pounds. This includes the stove and Jetboil 1 litre insulated pot, my old 1 pint Cascade cup, the supplied Jetboil dish, and Jetboil fork and spoon, and my thick 4-ply aluminum foil wind shield. The wind shield is well worth bringing as it reduces cooking time and therefore saves fuel on those windy days.
The fuel cannisters come in two sizes. The larger holds 7.76 oz. of fuel and weighs 13 oz. The smaller holds 3.88 oz of fuel and weighs 7 oz. Since I rode a horse, I mostly lived on the trail rather than hitching into towns as the hikers do. I would leave my horse in good care and drive my rig ahead and cache (buried and well camouflaged) my resupplies - my food and my horse's food, and my fuel canisters, at road crossings and near PCT trailheads. I would then hitch back to my horse. Sometimes I would be lucky and get a ride offered by an Angel. I cooked my meals, breakfasts and dinners. and found that the larger fuel canisters would last 6 to 7 days. I always also brought a smaller canister as a back-up but can remember only needing to use it once.
MendoRider/Ed Anderson
--- On Fri, 4/9/10, dsaufley <dsaufley at sprynet.com> wrote:
> From: dsaufley <dsaufley at sprynet.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Class of 2010 - Fuel Canisters, Agua Dulce
> To: pct-l at mailman.backcountry.net
> Date: Friday, April 9, 2010, 4:56 PM
> For many years, the fabulous Agua
> Dulce Hardware Store has been donating
> denatured alcohol (amongst other things) for PCT
> hikers.? We just love the
> folks at the hardware store, and they are so supportive of
> the hikers and
> the trail.? To add to their ongoing support, the
> owner, Trish Brewer,
> offered to stock hiker-type fuel canisters, saving many of
> you hiker-types
> the trip to REI or other venues.? I have the lists of
> things hikers buy, but
> it's short on specifics when it comes to the types of fuel
> canisters a
> retailer should carry.? So here's a few questions:
>
>?
>
> What brands of fuel canisters do hikers want?? (i.e,
> Snow Peak, MSR, etc.)
>
> What size of fuel canisters are wanted?
>
> How many of you would like to pick up a fuel canister while
> passing through
> Agua Dulce?
>
>?
>
> It would only take Trish a short time to stock up, so if
> you let me know
> ahead, together we'll make sure the fuel cans are
> available.? BTW, they've
> already got an awesome collection of cool looking walking
> staffs :o)?
>
>?
>
> L-Rod (the Animal Magnet)
>
>?
>
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> The first step.? The last step.? The most
> important step:? protect the PCT.
> www.pcta.org/help/donate_form.asp
>
>?
>
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------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 20:29:01 -0700
From: "Lance Marshall" <lancem at wvi.com>
Subject: [pct-l] fuel canister by USPS?
To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <462E7F92DB7143CDB6EF94A5FF92DC3A at lancedesktop>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Anna,
Department of Transportation (DOT) rules allow ground transportation of
propane/butane canisters in containers with a capacity of not more than
4 ounces. They are classified as 'Other Regulated Material - Domestic'.
The package must be marked ORM-D, Consumer Commodity. This applies to
UPS, FedEx, and other freight haulers.
Unfortunately backpacker's fuel canisters don't qualify.
Officials recently discovered that MSR canisters had a capacity of 6
ounces although they were filled with only 4 ounces of fuel and
therefore did not qualify for the ORM-D exemption from certain Hazardous
Material restrictions.
http://www.outdoorindustry.org/pdf/HazMatExemptionsFuelWN081209.pdf
The Postal Service is not bound by DOT regulations although it follows
DOT regulations closely and can even be more restrictive.
Postal regulations don't have the same 4 ounce limitation, and therefore
certain small canisters should be mailable by ground as ORM-D. However,
because of the confusion between DOT and Postal regulations and the
recent revelation about MSR canisters, you might find that your local
post office won't accept the canisters for ground mail.
Air transportation is an absolute no.
Good luck!
------------------------------
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