[pct-l] Rain Jacket

Tue Dec 21 20:32:30 CST 2010

i miss-spoke,  i use the gamma AR it was the first one i got on sale, a 
softshell... not waterproof at all...

the one i use now is the Theta AR ...  it is 17.5 ounces size small Mens.  our 
work buys us clothing for the elements, but retail these cost in the 450 to 500$ 
range.  to get the jacket and pants you're almost at 1,000$
i will say i'll spend ten hours at a time on the road sides in the rain... with 
semi trucks sloshing you with road-slop etc.  and never get wet.  in the winter 
i get slushed by the schoolbusses etc;  and never get intrusion.  so 1,000$ 
outfit is a small price to pay because i wear it 5 or 6 days a week and have for 
2+ years.  this week i washed it for the first time (in 2 years) to touch up the 
DWR

i'm surprised water got in through the membrane,  have you turned it inside out 
and examined the seam tape?  maybe a flaw?  but it doesn't seem localized enough 
to be that.  as i understand it,  my Precip pants are a full membrane layer and 
have never leaked.  

one thing i never do is pull up my nts layer sleeves,   your body needs those to 
wick, and it'll allow the jacket to dispel the moisture much better . . . a lot 
of people who don't sweat will when in a rainshell,  slowly it just accumulates 
in the jacket ,and without a good wicking fabric it'll condense on you.  once it 
condenses into droplet form,  either on your skin or the jacket,  it will not 
transpire in or out.  have your baselayer (or nts layer same thing) on yoru skin 
allows your perspiration to absord into the fabric and then yoru body heat 
vapourizes it and lets it breath out.   any shell,  even he newest proshell 3L 
will stay wet inside without some kind of wicking layer on your body in hard 
use.

i am intrigued you said the DWR was not working in the same place it condensed 
and got wet inside.   when the DWR wears off and the outer layer absorbs water, 
it breathes much less.  you could try a spray on DWR in those heavy use areas?

hope this help,
~Paul

________________________________
From: Lisa Freathy <rainorshinecamper at yahoo.com>
To: Paul Robison <paulrobisonhome at yahoo.com>; pct-l <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Tue, December 21, 2010 9:09:39 PM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Rain Jacket

Hi Paul,

Thanks for the feedback!

To answer your questions, the hood was on and cinched closed tightly. The main 
area of wetness was on the lower arms. I noticed almost 20 min. into hiking that 
the inner arm (the part that was brushing back and forth across my wet 
mid-section) appered to be absorbing the water as this material was darker in 
color and the water was not beading as it was elsewhere. I  I am pretty positive 
the wet arms and upper back were from rain vs. sweat as I typically do not sweat 
much at all and I was taking a fairly short/easy hike. 

After about an hour the wetness was enough to stick the jacket to my bare lower 
arm (after pushing up the sleeves of my thin baselayer I was wearing underneath) 
but had yet to soak through the shirt I was wearing on the upper back area. I am 
concerned as to how wet I would end up after 6-12 hours of being in the rain!

Do you know exactly how heavy your ArcTeryx shell is?
 Lisa 

"Keep close to Nature's heart... and break clear away, once in awhile, and climb 
a mountain or spend a week in the woods. Wash your spirit clean."
~ John Muir 

________________________________
 From: Paul Robison <paulrobisonhome at yahoo.com>
To: Lisa Freathy <rainorshinecamper at yahoo.com>; pct-l <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Tue, December 21, 2010 5:54:11 PM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Rain Jacket

did the leakage come in through around the neck?  did you have the hood on ? 
are you 100% sure you weren't wet from your own skin?  i have foudn with my 
paclite jackets that i 'feel' a lot more wet than i actually am because i get a 
thin layer of water on me from my skin and then feel the water on the outside of 
the jacket.  a good NTS layer is vital in keeping this from happening.  i used 
to swear i was getting wet in my MHW typhoon jacket, whenever i wore short 
sleeves... it was just a precipitation layer inside.  

as far a better jackets,  sure;  if you want to invest in a good proshell 3L 
jacket it'll not only keep you dry but feel drier, and breath much much better.  
i use the ArcTeryx gamma AR at work and it is an excellent shell... but it is 
quite heavy and VERY expensive.

washing in a water repellent will have no effect on the membrane type of 
waterproofings.  the only thing  it will do is perhaps allow the water to bead 
and roll off better... this will allow it to breath better (in theory,  i've 
seen no difference in practice).

pre-cip or GoreTex Paclite are excellent products for their WEIGHT.  in my 
opinion, when hiking the lighter weight is worth it.  but a good NTS layer is 
necessary when using a light 2 layer fabric.

hope some of this info. is useful,
~Paul

________________________________
 From: Lisa Freathy <rainorshinecamper at yahoo.com>
To: pct-l <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Tue, December 21, 2010 8:25:29 PM
Subject: [pct-l] Rain Jacket

I have the Marmot Pre-Cip and have owned since last year, yet have only had the 
chance to test it out a few times. 2-3 short hikes in the rain last year and I 
stayed dry, yet today I took it out for a trial run in the steady rain and my 
arms and upper back soaked through within an hour. Minimal water leakage, but 
still no good especially since it happened so quickly.

Have others had this experience with this jacket? Are there other good jackets 
out there that have stood up to hours of rain, or if it is truly pouring for 
hours do no  jackets really keep you totally dry?

Trying to decide what to do now... use a wash in "water repellent" and try my 
jacket in the rain again, return to REI and replace with another pre-cip or try 
a new jacket all together?

Bummed out as I thought I had my rain jacket taken care of and now I am back to 
researching yet another piece of gear.
 Lisa 

"Keep close to Nature's heart... and break clear away, once in awhile, and climb 

a mountain or spend a week in the woods. Wash your spirit clean."
~ John Muir 

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