[pct-l] Stove choice :-S

[Paul Robison]

just remember that combustion is seldom ideal...   so while that ideal equation 
would result in a completely clean burning energy source;  real life gets in the 
way...  and any flame CAN produce carbon monoxide.

it is also very important ot understand the affects of carbon monoxide 
poisoning.  it repalces oxygen in your red blood cells; and eventually no amount 
of fresh air can save you.   carbon dioxide displaces oxygen, but worst case 
scenario you breathe some fresh air and you're fine.
~Paul




________________________________
From: giniajim <jplynch at crosslink.net>
To: Paul Robison <paulrobisonhome at yahoo.com>; pct-l at backcountry.net
Sent: Thu, December 30, 2010 6:44:08 PM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Stove choice :-S

 
Thanks; very helpful.  Is this the chemical  equation:
2 CH3OH + 3 O2 → 2 CO2 + 4  H2O
 
(found it on Wikipedia).
----- Original Message ----- 
>From: Paul Robison 
>To: pct-l at backcountry.net 
>Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 6:24    PM
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Stove choice    :-S
>
>
>
>the amount of CO given off burning methanol is a small    small fraction of what 
>it 
>
>is when burning petroleum based fuels, ie.    canister stoves.
>
>yes all burning COULD give off trace amounts of    CO,  but methanol because it 
>of 
>
>it's oxygen in it's molecular    formation actually burns off and gives off 
>CO2,  
>
>which, btw can still    suffocate you through displacement; but it's not a toxin 
>
>like carbon    monoxide.  in an open burning stove, if all the gas is burned 
>completely then theoretically there is no CO give off when burning any    
>alcohol 
>
>product.  only when the flame is starved for oxygen is    ignition not complete 
>and 
>
>carbon monoxide is generated.  this is also    true of canister fuels;  but is 
>it 
>
>MUCH hard to provide enough oxygen    for a complete burn of petrol products 
>because of the amount of energy    that the same volume of fuel contains.  it 
>takes 
>
>5 times the volume    of oxygen to complete the ignition process of petroluem 
>fuels 
>
>as it does    alcohol fuels.  with our ambient atmosphere being about 21% 
>oxygen;  
>
>getting 'more' out of an open burning design is virtually    impossible.
>~Paul
>
>
>
>
>________________________________
>From:    giniajim <jplynch at crosslink.net>
>To: Aaron    Wallace <aaron at skeeky.com>; ned at mountaineducation.org; 
>pct-l at backcountry.net
>Sent: Thu,    December 30, 2010 5:55:26 PM
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Stove choice    :-S
>
>Would that not apply to all stoves?  They all burn something    right and 
>produce 
>
>CO.  I wouldn't use any stove in an closed    space.
>
>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>  From: Aaron    Wallace 
>  To: ned at mountaineducation.org ; pct-l at backcountry.net 
>  Sent:    Wednesday, December 29, 2010 11:26 PM
>  Subject: Re: [pct-l] Stove    choice :-S
>
>
>
>  Just be careful using an MSR Reactor in an    enclosed or poorly-ventilated 
>area--the backpackinglight.com reviewers    found that this stove puts out an 
>extremely high level of carbon    monoxide.  (The JetBoil doesn't do much better 
>in 
>
>this respect...).    While ideally you can operate your stove outdoors in 
>accordance with all    the warning stickers, sometimes the weather isn't 
>cooperating and it's    necessary to cook inside your shelter--the Reactor does 
>not 
>
>seem to be a    stove that can be safely used in this scenario.
>
>
>  On Dec 27,    2010, at 10:59 PM, "ned at mountaineducation.org" 
><ned at mountaineducation.org>    wrote:
>
>  > I'm sorry if I didn't make that clear. We tested    both the Jetboils 
>(personal 
>
>and group) and MSR (Reactor and group) stoves    while we were out for two 
>months 
>
>between KM and Muir Trail Ranch during    May and June. The Reactor was totally 

>impressive and comes from us highly    recommended. We will issue a formal 
>product 
>
>review soon.
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > "Just remember, Be Careful out    there!"
>  > 
>  > Ned Tibbits, Director
>  >    Mountain Education
>  > 1106A Ski Run Blvd
>  > South Lake    Tahoe, Ca. 96150
>  >    P: 888-996-8333
>     >    F: 530-541-1456
>  >    C:    530-721-1551
>  >    http://www.mountaineducation.org
>     > 
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