[pct-l] Snow Shoes vs. Timing for snow on a thru

Mon Oct 25 22:42:54 CDT 2010

I know all the theories about timing climbs for when the snow is hard, 
crossing creeks in the morning, post holing in soft snow in the afternoon, 
and getting off the passes early to avoid storms. But I found the firmest 
rules in thru-hiking were 1) 20 miles/day and 2) camp below the snow for 
warmth.  I just can't sit around in a tent waiting for the right time. 
Besides I would run out of food. That seems like a more severe problem than 
crossing creeks in the afternoon or crossing passes in the mid-afternoon.

We have crossed the High Sierra in trail runners twice starting near 
mid-June. I kicked steps straight up to Mather Pass in 2000.  And it was 
firm early morning snow.  And plunge stepped down the north side of all 
those passes. Many times the trail was running with snow melt. You could 
either walk in it or try the slicker sides of the trail.

Yeah, our feet got wet, but it is amazing how fast our feet dry. Usually 
before the next creek crossing.

Someone wrote about hiking in Chaco's. I haven't tried them, but we have 
gravitated toward simpler and lighter shoes. Our current shoe preferences 
have almost no support. They are a slab of foam with some mesh to hold it 
under the foot. They're very light, and our feet are stronger and ache less. 
At home I am wearing Crocs most of the time. My boots have collected dust 
for many years. Ten years ago I would never have believed my current shoe 
choices.

Ken
www.GottaWalk.com

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <ned at mountaineducation.org>
To: "PCT MailingList" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2010 5:56 PM
Subject: [pct-l] Snow Shoes vs. Timing for snow on a thru

Gary is absolutely correct. Timing is everything during the thru hiking
season.

Cross your creeks in the morning when the creek's flow should be lowest in
volume and white-water(depends on the distance from the headwater melt to
you and the ambient temps, of course).

Make your climbs to the passes in mid-morning, after the sun (should you
have any) has softened the surface and you can make a foot-hold that will
keep your footwear from slipping on traverses. Keep in mind that most
approaches to passes are not flat, thus you'll need to kick some kind of
foot-holds with the sides of your shoes. Once you get to the steep slopes of
the pass, you might want to strap on those Katoola KTS devices to help with
the sub-surface ice (if it is present). Make sure whatever devices you use
for traction aids (vs. microspikes) will not slide off your feet when you
have to make an emergency sidestep to catch your footing. Test out your
choice before you have to rely on it in the backcountry!

If you start post-holing, it is too late. You'll learn how to time your
ascents as you approach the higher elevations, in this case between Chicken
Spring and Forester. Get up the passes while the snow is still hard
underneath, soft enough on top to hold your shoe/traction device. Noon works
as a general time objective if the ambient temp is not too hot. If you're in
the midst of the thaw, you may have to make your ascents earlier in the
morning.

Descents off the pass and the slog through the snow away from it until you
reach mud is the next issue. Again, everything is based on the conditions of
the day. If temps are hot and snow is melting everywhere around you, get an
early start so that you can clear the snow fields on the other side of the
pass before you start post-holing. The objective is not to just get over the
pass, it is to clear the fields on the other side.

Example from this year:
Coming up from our campsite in Big Pete Meadow in LeConte canyon on July
1st, we hit snow just above Starr's Camp at mile 836 (or at 10,800 feet)
(major suncups in about two feet of snow). All the rest of the way to Muir
Pass (two and a half miles) we couldn't see the trail, so navigation was by
line of sight. From Helen Lake to the pass was late in the day (did a lot of
filming on the way up) and we were posting on the ascent--not fun, but with
snow shoes and going straight up by self-belaying with long ice axes, it was
easy.

The backside, or north side in this case was a huge and long six-mile slog
all the way down to the other end of Evolution Lake and full of wicked,
slippery suncups best done in early to mid-morning to prevent the injurious
post-holing we had to endure (filming too much all the way down). Snow shoes
really don't help much with suncups, at least while they're still firm; once
they soften, snow shoes can plow through the ridges, spanning the dips, and
make for a safer, and less jarring ride.

Our take on Snow shoes for a thru hike:
If you leave "early" to give your schedule lots of time to reach Canada
before the early season soft snow buries the trail and where you don't have
to hike too many miles per day, and if there are still snow storms hitting
the Sierra like this year (before the end of May while we were at Forester),
snow shoes allow you to keep hiking over snow when everyone else is falling
through and maybe getting hurt. This was the case for us when we arrived at
Siberian Outpost on May 19th--we could not have made it through in the soft
conditions we found there that day if we didn't have snow shoes to quickly
and conveniently strap on (we would have either had to slog it through at
great expense of energy and hazard of injury or stop right there and wait
for morning and firmer snow). Snow shoes will help you with any new snow
fall, should you get any at that time of year (we had three storms hit us
between KM and Forester in May. No major accumulation, but really cold,
zero-degree nights).

If you leave with the "herd," trying to optimize your Sierra entry date, you
will probably not need snow shoes at all and be quite happy with the
Katoolas should you have anything risky or slippery to deal with after a
cold night. The key, here, is timing your ascents and descents so you start
on "dry trail" in the morning and are able to end each day on similar "dry
trail" before nightfall. Even with the high snowpack of this past winter,
2009-2010, most thru hikers got through the Sierra adequately without snow
shoes; we carried them because we were testing them and gathering research
for our future Snow Guide to the PCT. (If you have any specific concerns,
please email us and we'll help alleviate your fears, should you have any).

Four serious words of caution:
1) chronic wet feet are not happy feet, ones willing to kick foot-holds in
hard snow, toe-up passes or heel-plunge down the back side. Test your choice
of footwear in multi-week snow to see if that is fine with you. We never had
wet feet, but many around us did.
2) Soft footwear that can be easily twisted in your hands may not be able to
hold an edge in crusty snow on a steep traverse typical of those you'll have
to negotiate on all of the higher Sierra passes.
3) By the time you get there, your tread pattern may be sufficiently worn
down that you may not have a secure enough grasp of what traction surface
you find, such that things may be really slippery and you're prone to falls
in the steep stuff. Consider replacing your shoes at KM; just picking up
Katoolas may not prevent slip and falls, should you remember to put them on
before crossing what appears to be a slippery slope. Consider traditional
boots from KM through the snow as they have torsional rigidity, great, deep
tread, real heels for braking on descents, and are usually waterproofable
along the way. Take gaitors.
4) Carry and know how to use a certified ice axe for self-arrest, uphill
anchors, and glissade rudders.

You may encounter snow in the San Jacintos, San Bernardinos, and San
Gorgonios. Know how to navigate the trail through the trees. Know what to
watch for. Once above timberline, know the hazards to avoid. Depending on
the winter preceding your thru hike attempt, how much it dumped and where,
the timing of the thaw, and the date you started will all dictate the kind
of conditions you'll have to deal with.

Ok, Class of 2010, chime in here to tell all of us your experiences with
snow from the Desert Divide to Tahoe...

Ned Tibbits, Director
Mountain Education
1106A Ski Run Blvd
South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
    P: 888-996-8333
    F: 530-541-1456
    C: 530-721-1551
    http://www.mountaineducation.org
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gary Wright" <gwtmp01 at mac.com>
To: "Brick Robbins" <brick at brickrobbins.com>
Cc: "PCT" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2010 12:42 PM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] snow shoes

>
> On Oct 25, 2010, at 3:32 PM, Brick Robbins wrote:
>> Has anyone else seen anything that works?
>
> Probably not what you meant but it should be mentioned, that timing is
> everything.
>
> 1) Wait for more snow to melt before entering the high country.
> 2) Plan to make camp so that you:
> - start crossing snow fields in mid-morning
> - cross the pass around noon
> - leave the snow fields by mid-afternoon
>
> Not always possible to do this but it helps you avoid the frozen, icy
> conditions
> of early morning on the passes and the melting, post-holing conditions of
> mid to
> late afternoon.  It can also help you avoid late-afternoon thunderstorms
> at
> the passes if that is the sort of weather pattern that is in play.
>
> I did pretty well with this strategy in 2004 but ignored my own advice
> when
> crossing Muir pass in 2007.  That was a really long slog.  I think I added
> a
> couple miles by zig-zagging between rock outcroppings to avoid postholing.
>
> Radar
>
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Ned Tibbits, Director
Mountain Education
1106A Ski Run Blvd
South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
    P: 888-996-8333
    F: 530-541-1456
    C: 530-721-1551
    http://www.mountaineducation.org
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