[pct-l] Ned's Forum on Postholer.Com

[ned at mountaineducation.org]

It is interesting how things change and how people perceive and evaluate 
those changes.

Take Mountain Education, for instance. We started teaching wilderness safety 
skills back in 1982 by offering winter-only courses at fixed prices. That 
lasted until 2004 when we discontinued the school for lack of interest. 2005 
brought it back by popular demand and we offered more courses at 
"donation-only" prices. In 2011 we were encouraged to become a non-profit 
and explored that option for the summer. We have finally settled on running 
the school as a for-profit business offering courses with a "suggested 
donation" price.

"Suggested donation" pricing works for us because it encourages our students 
to listen, apply, and get the most from what we are teaching and allows them 
to evaluate its worth to them, thereafter reflected in what they donate at 
the end of their course. Some donate nothing, most do the suggested amount, 
and a few donate more than that. Some people want to get stuff for free, 
especially if it is offered that way, while others appreciate the effort 
required of the teachers and donate as they see fit to the degree they 
learned.

So, we have now settled in as a nasty commercial venture trying to help 
people have fun and safe trips of their own in wilderness at a price they 
can decide. Scott doesn't like commercial ventures. Ok. He provides a very 
valuable source of information to the hiking community for free and that is 
good!


"Just remember, Be Careful out there!"

Ned Tibbits, Director
Mountain Education
South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
    P: 888-996-8333
    F: 530-541-1456
    C: 530-721-1551
    http://www.mountaineducation.org
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Scott" <public at postholer.com>
To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2012 3:16 PM
Subject: [pct-l] Ned's Forum on Postholer.Com


> About 4 years ago Ned asked if I would promote Mountain Education on
> postholer.com. I told Ned that I don't allow advertisements. He
> completely understood. Ned's not the first to ask, Rees Hughes was also
> very persistent in unsuccessfully getting his book advertised on the
> site. And there were others as well.
>
> Anyways, about 2 years later Ned had started operating Mountain
> Education on a 'donations only' basis, as in no fee. Ned had been
> contributing some fantastic articles to the PCT forum on postholer.com
> so I offered him his own forum. As we know he accepted and continued
> contributing some great information to the community.
>
> As a bit of background, Ned asked on several occasions if I would build
> his Mountain Education web-site. I always said 'no' as I couldn't devote
> the time it would deserve.
>
> Last winter Ned made 2 big mistakes.
>
> First, he was encouraging early start dates into the Sierra that was
> fully packed with snow. I *did not* want to encourage average hikers
> into following what I believe was really, really bad advice. To say I've
> been quite vocal about with my dissent would be an understatement.
>
> Second, he moved from 'donations only' to a fee based service boasting
> as a 'non-profit' which Mountain Education is not. This was totally
> against my policy which we established 2 years earlier. He was now using
> the postholer site to promote his commercial venture.
>
> Ned's forum was removed from public view.
>
> The forum is still there with all its content available to Ned only. He
> can add to it, delete from it or move it at his leisure to his new site.
> It's just no longer public.
>
> That is the complete story.
>
> -postholer
>
> -- 
> www.postholer.com
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