<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div>Yeah, that's basically what I've been hearing on and off list -- nice place to visit, don't spend too much time there. I also think a lot of the negative emotions about the place being a combination of a single bad experience ruining the feel of the place for some and as you said, tight budgets influencing the thinking of others. I have heard good things, though... I probably won't stay or get a resupply package here but I will probably stop in and have a soda or some chips or other luxury junk food.</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>Thanks for all the info, guys, its good to get a variety of opinions when making a judgement like this.</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><br><div><div>On Jan 8, 2008, at 3:08 PM, Donna Saufley wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="blue"><o:smarttagtype namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PlaceType"><o:smarttagtype namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PlaceName"><o:smarttagtype namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="City"><o:smarttagtype namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="place"><div class="Section1"><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy; ">VVR is an interesting place and I’d say definitely worth a visit. With regard to the mudhole, they were draining both<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><st1:city w:st="on">Florence</st1:city><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>and<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:placename w:st="on">Edison</st1:placename><st1:placetype w:st="on">Lakes</st1:placetype></st1:place><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>last year around August or September for some kind of dam maintenance. I don’t know what the expectation is for the coming season.<o:p></o:p></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy; "><o:p> </o:p></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy; ">The eclectic camp at VVR is a lively place in season with a convergence of fishermen, intrepid four-wheelers, campers, JMT south bounders, and nobo PCTers. I really enjoyed the boat ride to and from. The food was excellent and reasonably priced for a remote location, and the store was stocked with many hiker-type items. Everything single thing there is hauled in by the proprietor and crew many miles on a rough mountain road, so everything is a precious and limited commodity for which they rightfully charge. Consequently, hikers have found that by the time they add up their food, beer, phone calls, laundry, etc. charges, they have a bit of a tab. Keep in mind that most hikers are on a limited budget, and paying up for anything tends to be painful to them and a source of complaint. <o:p></o:p></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy; "><o:p> </o:p></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy; ">I sent my resupply box to Muir Trail Ranch (so I could carry seven days of food instead of nine) and then stopped at VVR. They’re extremely nice folks at MTR, and there was good stuff in their hiker box. They are more set up for their dude ranch group activities than for the needs of thru-hikers, but it was worth the short side-trip to go there.<o:p></o:p></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy; "><o:p> </o:p></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy; ">Hope that helps.<o:p></o:p></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy; "><o:p> </o:p></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy; ">L-Rod<o:p></o:p></span></font></div><div><div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 12pt; "><hr size="2" width="100%" align="center" tabindex="-1"></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma; font-weight: bold; ">From:</span></font></b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:pct-l-bounces@backcountry.net">pct-l-bounces@backcountry.net</a> [<a href="mailto:pct-l-bounces@backcountry.net" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">mailto:pct-l-bounces@backcountry.net</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b>Robert W. Freed<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">Sent:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Tuesday, January 08, 2008 10:47 AM<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">To:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:pct-l@backcountry.net" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">pct-l@backcountry.net</a><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">Subject:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [pct-l] VVR -- 2007ers, should I avoid in 2008?</span></font><o:p></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 12pt; "><o:p> </o:p></span></font></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 12pt; ">I spent a night there in early June and found it great. One of the best steaks I think I have ever had. Of course after a couple hundred trail miles everything tastes good. Showers, laundry, food, beer and a free tent cabin if there is room. Bears a plenty at night but with food lockers and ear plugs I never noticed them.<o:p></o:p></span></font></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 12pt; "> On the other hand, on the way there I heard horror stories about VVR. Over crowded, out of control bears, the mud hole that used to be Lake Thomas A. Edison, etc... But I had a good time and plan to stop there in '08.<o:p></o:p></span></font></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 12pt; "> <o:p></o:p></span></font></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 12pt; ">Robert<o:p></o:p></span></font></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 12pt; "> <o:p></o:p></span></font></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 12pt; ">>>>>>>>>Patrick Beggan <<a href="mailto:meta474@gmail.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">meta474@gmail.com</a>> Wrote:>>>>>>>>><br>I've been reading Yogi's guidebook and also reading around the <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>internet and it seems that since 2003 VVR has developed a bad <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>reputation. Have they gotten a handle on things in 2007, or was it <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>just as bad as 06/05/04?<br><br>I'd like to stop in there but I'll avoid it and use Muir Trail Ranch <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>or something, if necessary.<o:p></o:p></span></font></div></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 12pt; "><o:p> </o:p></span></font></div><p style="margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size: 10pt; ">No virus found in this incoming message.<br>Checked by AVG Free Edition.<br>Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.13/1214 - Release Date: 1/8/2008 1:38 PM</span></font><o:p></o:p></p></div><br><p style="margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; "><font size="2">No virus found in this outgoing message.<br>Checked by AVG Free Edition.<br>Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.13/1214 - Release Date: 1/8/2008 1:38 PM<br></font></p>_______________________________________________<br>Pct-l mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Pct-l@backcountry.net" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">Pct-l@backcountry.net</a><br>To unsubscribe or change list options (digest, etc):<br><a href="http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l</a><br></o:smarttagtype></o:smarttagtype></o:smarttagtype></o:smarttagtype></div></span></blockquote></div><br></body></html>